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Other BSD and UNIX/UNIX-like Any other flavour of BSD or UNIX that does not have a section of its own.

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Old 11th September 2020
flfederation flfederation is offline
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Default Only sort of about the FSF / free software

I think every few months (years) or so, someone comes here to try to argue that BSD should jump on the GNU bandwagon.

This is NOT one of those posts. It's more accurate to say I'm fleeing, than trying to convert anybody here.

I will state where I'm coming from, but what I'm looking for is personal or historical accounts, or personal opinions. I'm on a fact-finding mission, not a crusade.

First of all, I'm posting from OpenBSD. It's nice. It's about as close to what I'm looking for right now as anything out there. OpenBSD fan, right here. I've also tried FreeBSD. I've migrated most of my equipment to BSD.

I won't deny being a Stallman fan, but I'm not here to defend him. I don't think he's coming back, you don't need to worry.

I'm most interested in the history of BSD, I've been trying to soak it up in bulk. I've read about it, I've been watching various BSD talks (Jason Dixon on GPL & BSD is Dying, Theo de Raadt on Pledge and Colin Percival on side channel attacks) along with videos about the history (USL vs. BSDi, etc.)

I think BSD got kind of a raw deal. I won't pretend to be a fan of modern Open Source, but OpenBSD was "Open" before "Open Source" was coined and before OSI was founded.

So there's open source and Open Source, and the former doesn't seem that bad.

My question comes down to this: rms and the FSF had a number of "quibbles" with BSD, which someone parodied in the song "Home to Hypocrisy". I am aware that not every BSD has exactly the same politics or goals, and I'm not asking anybody to speak for all BSDs here-- just the ones that matter to them.

What (if anything) could have free software have done differently, to help out or be fairer to BSD? I'm expecting some pithy answers, that's alright. I might get some interesting answers too. Not here to debate the Free Software side of it-- I'm sure you've heard all that before. I'll continue researching this on my own time, of course.
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Old 14th September 2020
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Carpetsmoker Carpetsmoker is offline
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This isn't really specific to BSD, but I've written a few lengthy comments about the FSF and the like last month over here (username: arp242): https://lobste.rs/s/gywiju/freedom_isn_t_free

Specifically for BSD, the whole "oh, you allow people to install non-free software? You're not promoting Freedom and we can't recommend BSD"-take needlessly antagonized a lot of people and wasn't helpful in any way, for the concept of Free Software or anyone else.
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Old 14th September 2020
flfederation flfederation is offline
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Thanks for the quotes. Loads of interesting stuff here.

I'm mixing Keith Packard up with the third programmer to work on BSD, but he worked on X and I suppose, his ejection from Xfree86 is why we thankfully have X.org, similar perhaps to de Raadt getting shut out of the NetBSD codebase. I'm probably mistaken about several things there, but it's a starting place, it's not intended as Canon.
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Old 15th September 2020
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I think you're maybe confusing Keith Packard with Keith Bostic; I'm not sure exactly what you mean with "the third programmer to work on BSD", but Bostic did a lot of work on BSD in the 80s and 90s.
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Old 15th September 2020
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carpetsmoker View Post
I think you're maybe confusing Keith Packard with Keith Bostic
I did at first, but I caught it. They're both awesome. I only know Bostic's name because McKusick talks about him. I've looked him up on Wikipedia since then. Packard is on Wikipedia as well.

I think the history of this stuff is incredibly important, it makes the projects easier to understand and helps you to appreciate them. Of course I already appreciate BSD because I'm using it now, but knowing more about it makes it richer and more interesting.
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