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Other BSD and UNIX/UNIX-like Any other flavour of BSD or UNIX that does not have a section of its own. |
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Which BSD should I use?
I've used several BSDs over the past three or four years including OpenBSD, FreeBSD, NetBSD, and DragonFly. To me they all have things I really like about them but I still use Slackware for my main workstation partly because of my own ignorance and partly because the gnu tools make it easier to build most source on Linux than on BSD. I've been multibooting a bunch of different OS on one box and it wasn't a good way to really learn BSD because I didn't have a dedicated box to live with day to day.
I do now. I am setting up a new box and I want to choose one BSD that can do what I need. I have three major goals for this box. One, it should be a good desktop with all the applications I need. I've made acceptable desktops with all the BSD I mentioned so this is not an issue. Two, on Slackware I'm able to download source for just about anything and compile it and make my own package with the package tools available on Slackware. I don't understand how to do this on BSD because of the dual make/gmake, autoconf, configure, etc. It seems to me that I have to use ports or pkgsrc because things need so much tweaking to compile on BSD. Is there any easy way to do this yourself and not rely on something being in ports or pkgsrc? (I know you can make packages from ports or pkgsrc, but I want to be able to do this on my own. Is it reasonable & possible.) Three, I need to run Winbloze for some apps I need for my job. I refuse to waste a box on Bloze, so now I'm running it in VMWare. I need to be able to run a winbloze system in a VM or emulator. NetBSD seems to be a little behind FreeBSD on the VMWare version and OpenBSD doesn't have it at all in packages. I haven't checked ports yet. Thanks for any helpful suggestions. Rand
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO Last edited by Randux; 22nd December 2008 at 12:13 PM. |
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Welcome to daemonforums mate
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# pkg_add -r coreutils And all GNU command wil lbe avialable with g prefix (ls = gls, shred = gshred etc ...) Quote:
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religions, worst damnation of mankind "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." Linus Torvalds Linux is not UNIX! Face it! It is not an insult. It is fact: GNU is a recursive acronym for “GNU's Not UNIX”. vermaden's: links resources deviantart spreadbsd |
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I run Windows Firefox and Flash9 in Wine. It works, mostly, but there are sites where the videos do not play properly. I'd guess it works right for about 50% of the sites I visit; another 25% are so so, and 25% are dismal failures. I'd suspect it is similar for Opera, and of course it depends on the sites you visit. Sadly, this area of *BSD is not very strong. |
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I personally use WINE + Win Opera + Win Flash 10, works very good (only when in need of flash/java of course), its a lot faster then doing that @ Win4BSD, I would want to see a VirtualBox port to FreeBSD, its very fast especially with Guest Additions.
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religions, worst damnation of mankind "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." Linus Torvalds Linux is not UNIX! Face it! It is not an insult. It is fact: GNU is a recursive acronym for “GNU's Not UNIX”. vermaden's: links resources deviantart spreadbsd |
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Many years ago I had an old version of Acrobat (v4?) and Office 2000 running under Wine (I don't recall the version). Later, and even now, they don't. In between, they worked with some major diddling to which libraries were native and which were not (guided by Tom Wickline, who really knows Wine). With enough futzing you can get many things to work, particularly if they are older applications. But my goodness, it can take an unbelievable amount of work. VMs do work better for most things. Games are not one of those things, though. And BSD VMs stink. |
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Depends what games, I tried the ones that I mentioned @ VirtualBox with Guest Additions and they work real nice, like native I would say, IMHO porting VirtualBox to FreeBSD (along with contonuing work on Xen) should be very important targets.
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religions, worst damnation of mankind "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." Linus Torvalds Linux is not UNIX! Face it! It is not an insult. It is fact: GNU is a recursive acronym for “GNU's Not UNIX”. vermaden's: links resources deviantart spreadbsd |
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I'd like to hear from somebody who is running a winbloze guest how easy and clean it is to get going.
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO |
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@Randux
I havent tried it unformatunelly.
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religions, worst damnation of mankind "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." Linus Torvalds Linux is not UNIX! Face it! It is not an insult. It is fact: GNU is a recursive acronym for “GNU's Not UNIX”. vermaden's: links resources deviantart spreadbsd |
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OpenBSD and virtual machines
VMWare:
When a VMWare guest, the vic(4) and vmt(4) drivers provide kernel interoperability with the host OS. There is no longer a VMWare port/package for using OpenBSD as the host, after OpenBSD 4.4, due to conflicts between 3rd party kernel modules and these new drivers. QEMU: This is the most popular hardware emulator. There are others, in ports/emulators The kqemu accelerator is available for OpenBSD/i386, but functions only with uniprocessors. Last edited by jggimi; 22nd December 2008 at 03:52 PM. Reason: clarification on VMWare port |
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Hi guys, nice to see you both still working on BSD!
Thanks for the tip on Xen, Vermaden. I will keep it in mind. I'm still not sure about how helpful the coreutils package is. Can you compile anything on Net/FreeBSD that you can on Linux, without tweakage? And can you make your own packages automatically or do you have to be an expert?
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO |
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The BSDs are not Linux. There are some applications that will require no "tweakage" at all. Unfortunately, many applications designed for Linux are not so easily ported, due to "Linuxisms" which are not directly replicated in the BSDs. For ready examples, just review the patches created to port Linux-based applications to the various BSDs ports/pkgsrc systems. Port/package building systems vary between the BSDs. But I'm not aware of any of them that automagically build port/package infrastructure to create installable binary packages. Each requires some manual effort. There are Linux compatibility ABIs, but ... these are for prebuilt binary executables, not for Linux source code. And they have varying restrictions, such as architecture, syscall list, and scope of /procs emulation. |
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coreutils package provides these binaries:
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% pkg_info -L -x coreutils | grep bin /usr/local/bin/g[ /usr/local/bin/gbase64 /usr/local/bin/gbasename /usr/local/bin/gcat /usr/local/bin/gchgrp /usr/local/bin/gchmod /usr/local/bin/gchown /usr/local/bin/gchroot /usr/local/bin/gcksum /usr/local/bin/gcomm /usr/local/bin/gcp /usr/local/bin/gcsplit /usr/local/bin/gcut /usr/local/bin/gdate /usr/local/bin/gdd /usr/local/bin/gdf /usr/local/bin/gdir /usr/local/bin/gdircolors /usr/local/bin/gdirname /usr/local/bin/gdu /usr/local/bin/gecho /usr/local/bin/genv /usr/local/bin/gexpand /usr/local/bin/gexpr /usr/local/bin/gfactor /usr/local/bin/gfalse /usr/local/bin/gfmt /usr/local/bin/gfold /usr/local/bin/ggroups /usr/local/bin/ghead /usr/local/bin/ghostid /usr/local/bin/ghostname /usr/local/bin/gid /usr/local/bin/ginstall /usr/local/bin/gjoin /usr/local/bin/gkill /usr/local/bin/glink /usr/local/bin/gln /usr/local/bin/glogname /usr/local/bin/gls /usr/local/bin/gmd5sum /usr/local/bin/gmkdir /usr/local/bin/gmkfifo /usr/local/bin/gmknod /usr/local/bin/gmv /usr/local/bin/gnice /usr/local/bin/gnl /usr/local/bin/gnohup /usr/local/bin/god /usr/local/bin/gpaste /usr/local/bin/gpathchk /usr/local/bin/gpinky /usr/local/bin/gpr /usr/local/bin/gprintenv /usr/local/bin/gprintf /usr/local/bin/gptx /usr/local/bin/gpwd /usr/local/bin/greadlink /usr/local/bin/grm /usr/local/bin/grmdir /usr/local/bin/gseq /usr/local/bin/gsha1sum /usr/local/bin/gsha224sum /usr/local/bin/gsha256sum /usr/local/bin/gsha384sum /usr/local/bin/gsha512sum /usr/local/bin/gshred /usr/local/bin/gshuf /usr/local/bin/gsleep /usr/local/bin/gsort /usr/local/bin/gsplit /usr/local/bin/gstat /usr/local/bin/gstty /usr/local/bin/gsu /usr/local/bin/gsum /usr/local/bin/gsync /usr/local/bin/gtac /usr/local/bin/gtail /usr/local/bin/gtee /usr/local/bin/gtest /usr/local/bin/gtouch /usr/local/bin/gtr /usr/local/bin/gtrue /usr/local/bin/gtsort /usr/local/bin/gtty /usr/local/bin/guname /usr/local/bin/gunexpand /usr/local/bin/guniq /usr/local/bin/gunlink /usr/local/bin/guptime /usr/local/bin/gusers /usr/local/bin/gvdir /usr/local/bin/gwc /usr/local/bin/gwho /usr/local/bin/gwhoami /usr/local/bin/gyes Quote:
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# cd /usr/ports/sysutils/coreutils # make package http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/ http://www.cons.org/cracauer/freebsd.html
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religions, worst damnation of mankind "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." Linus Torvalds Linux is not UNIX! Face it! It is not an insult. It is fact: GNU is a recursive acronym for “GNU's Not UNIX”. vermaden's: links resources deviantart spreadbsd |
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I don't think it's really a "Linux -based software building requirement" so much as I don't want to have to depend on somebody else to have built all the packages I want. On Slackware I can do it myself, and in the end the system is a lot leaner.
I don't think that's really such an unreasonable goal and I wish it were simpler on BSDs.
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO |
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bsd or linux?
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My favourite BSD is OpenBSD.
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hitest |
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Thanks vermaden. I will read your links after I fix the latest problem I'm having
As an example, on Slackware I can download anything I want and compile and package it. As long as I get all the dependencies there is nothing to stop me. Now suppose on Net or FreeBSD I want to get the -2 version of something because I like it more than the newer ones. How do I do this and make a clean job of it? If the ports tree has the latest version, can I get some earlier version and not cause problems for myself? An example is claws-mail. I like to stay a few version back and let other people break instead. I see mucho problem reports on new claws-mail releases, while I'm happily running 3.2.0 with zero problems for a few years...
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO |
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>As an example, on Slackware I can download anything I want and compile and package it. As long as I get all the dependencies there is nothing to stop me.
Well it depends, I'm using Slack too since the beginning. Maybe 90% will compile without any problems, but try the same e.g. with Fedora, Debian etc. - there you will have maybe 70% success or less. With FreeBSD you should find most of the usual software in ports: http://www.freshports.org/ (at the moment 19515 ports). The rest should be a matter of some tweaking as mentioned above - nothing spectacular but necessary. |
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In the case of ports, you'll find that virtually everything is stored under CVS, including the makefiles for individual ports. When it comes to pkgsrc, I have no clue.
To do things "by hand", one should be able to fetch the dependencies, search the ports tree, and apply any necessary configure arguments or patches needed to make it compile -> and dig up old versions via CVS if necessary. With things not in the ports tree, to build by hand whether using the usual configure script & make process; you'll have to try it for yourself (making a port for it would be nice too, if you succeed). For more minor things, like an old version of claws-mail; I would guess flip to an old version of the Makefile and distinfo - so it fetches the version that you want instead, which would save you some time in doing things by hand (e.g. install claws-mail manually, using the ports files as a reference of what's needed to make it build on the system). The only thing I build myself outside of the ports tree, is usually vim; which I have automated into fetching, configuring, and building the code. (I generally build vim from source on all my machines, except for Windows). Some programs are more agreeable then others -- some really need kicking, Qt/KDE 4 bindings to Ruby are one example.
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My Journal Thou shalt check the array bounds of all strings (indeed, all arrays), for surely where thou typest ``foo'' someone someday shall type ``supercalifragilisticexpialidocious''. |
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