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Other BSD and UNIX/UNIX-like Any other flavour of BSD or UNIX that does not have a section of its own. |
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Uhm, no. I said I want to be able to do what I do with Slackware and that is to compile anything I find and make my own package out of it. I don't want to have to depend on other people with esoteric skills to make applications available.
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO |
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Then based on your repeated requirements -- which appear to be the ability to compile any sort of *nix code, found in-the-wild, on your own, without any detailed knowledge of your particular *nix environment or having any of your own *nix porting skills -- return to Slackware or a similar Linux environment.
Forget the *BSDs, then. Most FOSS code written for *nix environments is written for Linux, these days. You won't have to do much, if anything, other than follow the developers' step-by-step instructions. |
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jggimi is right. ports and pkgsrc are the strengths of BSD. You might as well use them. I consider what you have to do on Slackware a weakness. In fact, I've gone through that loop a million times when I used Slackware and it put me off quite a bit.
Win4BSD presents a problem because it's not compatible with the ULE scheduler. You need to revert to the 4BSD scheduler to actually get it to build. It does have some features that are nice like hovering window mode similar to what VirtualBox, Parallels, and VMWare Fusion have implemented as coherence, unity mode, etc.
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"UNIX is basically a simple operating system, but you have to be a genius to understand the simplicity." MacBook Pro (Darwin 9), iMac (Darwin 9), iPod Touch (Darwin 9), Dell Optiplex GX620 (FreeBSD 7.1-STABLE) |
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LOL jgimmi, yes my repeated requirements are to do what you said. I don't have time to learn every OS in the world. I have a job a family and I've been running Slackware for a few years and I can get it to do most of what I want. I don't think I should have to be a BSD-expert to be able to get the apps I want running, and I don't think compiling apps I do want without knowing every detail of the OS is some sort of capital offense except maybe in the eyes of a UNIX-snob or somebody with way too much time on his hands who makes snide remarks at the thought of anybody who had the nerve to ask a question like I did in this forum.
What is so offensive about asking if it's possible to make my own packages? Go back and read my opening post and see if you still think your nastiness is called for. One of the things I like least about UNIX is the prima donnas. Some stereotypes are unfortunately too true. Have a nice day! nijatux, I have no idea what you're talking about. We don't "have" to do anything with Slackware. I built hundreds of packages by tracking down all the real dependencies, choosing my own build options etc. and I set up a very nice system for myself that I use day in and day out without any problems. I chose Slackware over other distros specifically because I have to understand exactly what goes into my system and I have enough control without having to be a kernel developer. I make my own packages including only what I want and nothing else- no bloat. If I wanted a packaged system there are many to choose from, however that type of system is not for me. One of the things that bothers me most about Free, Net, and to a lesser extent OpenBSD is the package bloat. You have to install what the package maintainer wants, not what you want. I can build a Slackware system in about half the space of a similarly-equipped BSD. I don't need gstreamer, aspell, gnome-vfs or thousands of other so-called dependencies that really aren't, and I don't have those things on my Slackware systems. Try building a desktop in any BSD without all that crap..a good example is ROX-filer. Look what you need to build it on Linux and then look what you get when you install it from pkgsrc or ports in *BSD. Scary, isn't it
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO Last edited by Randux; 7th January 2009 at 08:47 AM. |
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religions, worst damnation of mankind "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." Linus Torvalds Linux is not UNIX! Face it! It is not an insult. It is fact: GNU is a recursive acronym for “GNU's Not UNIX”. vermaden's: links resources deviantart spreadbsd |
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Yes you were definitely a BIG help when I asked questions about options and streamlining things when I was running FreeBSD before
What are the knobs in FreeBSD? I couldn't find anything in man ports and man -k knobs didn't turn up anything. Is this explained somewhere? If I run it again I will have to ask you new questions because I can't find all the great threads on bsdforums.org anymore I had a few posts of my own I would like to find like fixing the emacs keymaps and setting prompts for all the different shells etc. I would still like to be able to make my own packages and not have to rely on the port maintainers. Anyway I am now installing Solaris and I will see if I can get the winbloze guest running and learn a little about making Solaris do what I want.
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO |
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I use vi most of the time and sometimes ed. Ask me how to customize vi and I will help you. My shell of choice is Korn. What do you want to do with it? Quote:
as simple as 1. Downloading source 2. Unzip/tar extract 3. Run ./config 4. make 5. make install If it doesn't compile patch the source and do it again. If it is GNU crap you probably need to use gmake instead of make. So who is preventing you from building your own packages? Last edited by Oko; 7th January 2009 at 09:53 AM. |
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# egrep -o -r "(WITH|WITHOUT)_[_0-9A-Z]+" /usr/ports | sort -u I am currently running OpenSolaris 2008.11 @ Dell Latitude D630 with 64bit VirtualBox from project's site and everything works great, especially with Guest Additions.
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religions, worst damnation of mankind "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." Linus Torvalds Linux is not UNIX! Face it! It is not an insult. It is fact: GNU is a recursive acronym for “GNU's Not UNIX”. vermaden's: links resources deviantart spreadbsd |
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Please bear with me if this is all review for you. First, on the complexity of "porting" applications: While Linux and the BSDs are both Unix-like, and appear very similar to end-users running shells or X Windows, they have remarkably different antecedents and are internally architected quite differently. BSD's history began as a series of enhancements and improvements to AT&T's Unix. Eventually, BSD replaced all AT&T code. Please consider the BSD-based OSes something akin to "forks" of AT&T Unix, from an operational and architectural perspective. Even when Unix was an AT&T-managed research tool in the 1970s, there were variations between implementations from platform to platform. If you wanted to run an application originally written for the PDP-11 on your VAX or Interdata, you had to "port" it. So Unix administrators were porters, as that was a required skill at the time.Second, regarding the Unix-like OS marketplace, Linux, and the porting/packaging of applications: The market leader for FOSS for Unix or Unix-like platforms, by a wide margin over any other, is Linux. As you already know. This is why you are likely to need less knowledge or skill to configure and compile an FOSS application on Linux than on any other.Because you reject the use of prepackaged binaries, and you reject the dependency requirements of porting work done by others, and you want to use any hunk of code you find online -- (written for Linux, in most cases)... Slackware is the distribution for you. Last edited by jggimi; 7th January 2009 at 04:44 PM. Reason: clarity, typos |
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I can see you are back to your usual helpful self. Great info.
To be clear I never said I rejected prepackaged binaries or anything else. I simply don't want to *have* to depend on someone else porting something I want. I want to be able to do that myself, and my question was how much effort/knowledge, etc was required and if it was reasonable. Then we ran off on a tangent... Even so, I still want a high-performing BSD to run as a secondary workstation. I may even try to develop some porting skills, but I have a full plate and can't give it the time I would like. I have pretty much given up on running any virtualization on BSD after trynig the big 3 and seeing the state of things and I'm pretty disappointed. In case anyone's interested, openSUSE has a VirtualBox package that is really amazing. First I tried the Xen and I was amazed at the poor performance. I have to say, though, the packaging of Xen on openSUSE is superb, nothing is left out from installing the Xen-enabled kernel, to automagically updating Grub, and reminding you to reboot. VirtualBox isn't packaged very smooth on openSUSE. It can only be run as root and you don't get the automagic popups to enter a root password when you try to execute it in Gnome, it silently dies. However, when you run it as it needs to be run, the GUI is fine and the performance is absolutely spectacular. Even Pig/OS runs like stink in VirtualBox. The scary thing about openSUSE is how much they hide the guts. I guess that makes it an outstanding bloze-replacement option and commercial choice. I hate to think what will happen if (when) all the magical smoke and mirrors break and something goes wrong. In the meantime I'm also going to install some BSD again on that box. I like them all for different reasons. I wish NetBSD were more stable. It's fast. OpenBSD is great as usual and now has pretty recent packages, you can make a really nice desktop. Even VLC looks great on my widescreen. I also like FreeBSD but I'm not sure why. I guess having Vermaden around makes it easy to like Peace, Rand
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BSDForums.org refugee #27 Multibooting with LILO Last edited by Randux; 7th January 2009 at 05:49 PM. |
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That's rather nonsense, to build a proper package for Slack you have to have some skills too. If you just do some ./configure ... && make install the you'll ruin your Slack at once because you have to rely on someone elses idea of a proper Linux installation. Try it, test it thoroughly and have fun.
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use UNIX or die :-) |
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I don't use pkgsrc, but I do use ports. FreeBSDs rox-filer port depends on the prerequisites from the X Windows System, GTK+, and a few Gnome related crap that appears to be required for common file manager stuff. What does Linux require? Quote:
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At the knobs thing, they can vary but there are some popular ones. You might want to read the documentation.
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My Journal Thou shalt check the array bounds of all strings (indeed, all arrays), for surely where thou typest ``foo'' someone someday shall type ``supercalifragilisticexpialidocious''. |
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Porting tends to be easy (or easier) if the devs have atleast considered the possibility of their software being used on a Unix that isn't Linux.
But generally its not easy. Hey, Grey Lehey even wrote a book about porting Unix software (please google). I guess one of the hurdles would be figuring out all the GNU stuff such as automake/autoconf. |
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That is fantastic book. From his web page you can also download freely Lion's Commentary, The Unix Text Processing, and The Complete FreeBSD. I just do not know of any better books for their target audience. Kernel Hacking, Text Processing using vi+sed+awk+Troff, and FreeBSD. |
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"UNIX is basically a simple operating system, but you have to be a genius to understand the simplicity." MacBook Pro (Darwin 9), iMac (Darwin 9), iPod Touch (Darwin 9), Dell Optiplex GX620 (FreeBSD 7.1-STABLE) |
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Just a small note to everyone:
Please keep things nice, it is obvious people expect different things from an operating system and have different preferences, this is why different operating systems exist. Please respect other peoples opinions and preferences, even if you might not agree with them.
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UNIX was not designed to stop you from doing stupid things, because that would also stop you from doing clever things. |
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Just follow the Hollywood method of "Which partner should I marry?"
Marry a partner you seem to like or love. If if after some time he or she annoys you too much, get a divorce and marry somebody else. If after a couple of marriages, you still prefer the original partner , just re-marry him or her. Simple isn't it ?
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You don't need to be a genius to debug a pf.conf firewall ruleset, you just need the guts to run tcpdump |
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