Obscure operating systems...

[censored]

Originally Posted by cats

Thanks for the welcome!

IMHO, that Register article is misleading.
Plan 9 isn't becoming a GNU project, it is just becoming available under the GPLv2 license, the same as Linux.

I don't know if I'm confused, or someone else is. I just downloaded the iso image from bell-labs.com. The thing would'nt boot on any of my machines, so I mounted the iso file directly. In the root directory are three license files. One is the old time Lucent license (LICENSE.LPL), another is version 2 GPL (LICENSE.GPL), and the last is just plain "LICENSE"

In the "LICENSE" file, it says that the license for Plan 9 is the LPL, but that specific included fonts are GPLv2 licensed.

My quick grep of the source directories indicated "LPL" for many of those files. The only places I saw GPL was in font related, antiword, diff, patch, cifs, and ghostscript files. Oh - and a couple games.

Is there a more recent set of images (other than bell-labs.com) that has files with a different license? This is probaby a license tweak that was misinterpreted...

[censored]

I may need to go digging for some old hardware, becuz it seems the Plan 9 compiler is not GNU and was said (someplace on the internet I recently visited) to be capable of building the ARM kernel for such things as (was it sheeva? maybe guru?) plug computers.

That could make Plan 9 more interesting for me...

Another thing I surfed across recently is the Glendix project (a bare bones Linux kernel and minimal user world setup, modfied to run Plan 9 programs). According to the site info, not much was needed beyond a small kernel modification, and the addition of a kernel module to effect the changes and run Plan 9 executable format images. I think the project was part of somebody's thesis, so it's been gathering a little dust. Interesing though ...

[hpabsdbeginner1]

eComStation 2.0 = pretty interface,similar to windows 2000/98 old style,but in my opinion is usesless,lacks of drivers and is commercial
ReactOS 0.3.12 = too unstable,great idea to make an open source windows
Haiku = powerful os,still in alpha,perfect for multimedia

[jkl]

Originally Posted by hpabsdbeginner1

eComStation 2.0 = pretty interface,similar to windows 2000/98 old style

Actually, OS/2 (eComStation's earlier name) had that style before.

Originally Posted by hpabsdbeginner1

powerful os,still in alpha,perfect for multimedia

This would require multimedia applications in the first place.

[censored]

Most people think *BSD operating systems are obscure! I guess it's a relative thing. Relative to the average computer user, I don't use anything but obscure operating systems. My fav OS list numbered six until today: *BSD, Haiku, Minix3, Plan9, OSRisc, and Bluebottle (A2). Today, I added O3one (o3one.org) as a potential candidate for the fav list.

O3one.org's Ozone

I've looked at lots of hobby OSes in my spare time, and generally I've found that the majority of them execute only the first portion of the boot loader before splatting. When I see a single author OS that goes beyond that, I take notice. The strange thing about O3one is that its web presence is sparse. There is one small article about it on OSNews, and little else that I can readily find. It hasn't been worked on for awhile (well, ages - 2004) - but the docs on the site are pleasantly readable. The author is obviously a very talented coder, and that idea shines through most of the site's documentation.

It could be that people tend to overlook it because it touts VMS-like features, and so they think it's some kind of derivative. Actually, according to the author, it's from scratch. He's incorporated the idea of UDI spec drivers (universal drivers used unchanged OS to OS) and some nifty other features. It's GPL2 licensed. I was able to get it running, and do some good things (which includes getting the network stack up and running, mounting CDs, editing files, and so on). I think if the Haiku guys had started with this as a base, they'd have taken less time to get where they are. Not to diminish NewOS in any way, but IMO the O3one project is much further along than what NewOS was when the Haiku guys tapped it.

I've been playing with O3one a couple days now, quite a few hours each day, and have had only three panics. One of the crashes may have affected the file system, but I'm not sure. Yet - relative to my experience with hobby OS projects, that's not terribly bad. It has potential.

I wonder if anyone on this forum has ever taken a look at the site? Warning: sunglasses suggested for viewing site

A2 / Bluebottle

Nice OS, but a little finicky about hardware. Helps to have really old stuff (grin). It does have a minimal browser and net stack, and I've cruised this forum with it :-)

CD ISOs are available from a university in Zurich (ethz.ch). Those folk (or others at the place) are now at work on a new OS (BarrelFish) - but currently it's available only as source...

[jkl]

Whoa. Surfed there, now I type blindly. Well done.

[roddierod]

when I hear VMS I get excited...now I am blind

[censored]

There has been an increase in the number of one-man (or small group) operating system projects, and I think this is a rebellion against (or a boredom caused by) the mainstream. Also, there is the creeping idea that really big software, in general, is a juicy target for (let us say generously) "security monitoring" - potentially done in a surreptitious manner.

Some of these projects have been simmering for awhile, and are just now reaching a level of capability that makes them interesting and (somewhat) useful for other than the developer's amusement.

Visopsys

So, recently I ran across Visopsys (visopsys.org), which the author has been constructing for around fifteen years. It ran OK on my real hardware, but I think the network stack is still a work-in-progress. Fifteen years is a stretch, I must say! The OS I mentioned in a previous post (O3zone) was developed for about seven years! I am a "weird/obscure/unknown OS" junkie/collector, but I try to collect only those that have reached a certain level of capability (a level more likely reached after 5, 7, or 15 years of development). Visopsys still lacks a web browser, but I don't think they're very far from having one. There may yet be some TCP/IP stack work needed to get there. They have a nice forum and a few devotees at visopsys.org.

Pedigree

Other operating systems start out as a venture of CS students, who after a few years, move on to other realms. It may be that the PedigreeOS system is in that category, but I'm not sure. It seems interesting though.

Syllable

An OS that is on my list to try eventually is Syllable. Supposedly, the server version of Syllable uses the Linux kernel instead of the one that follows the Atheos pedigree (although they say much has been changed in the latter). If true, Syllable server would be a "linux distro" (of sorts) but without the X windows graphics (assuming they used the original Syllable graphics system instead). Anyone know anything about this?

Jkl/roddierod: I did suggest sunglasses! Do I owe you a braille KB?

[censored]

A quick googling shows me something's happened recently on the Pedigree Project github, so it hasn't been abandoned yet...

MikeOS / Menuet

I've looked at MikeOS and Menuet, but it seems (to me) that few apps will ever exist for operating systems built mostly with assembly language...

Recently I took a look at the MonaOS (a "from scratch" kernel and OS project written by a Japanese person) - but I could not get it to work on my hardware. Has anyone had better luck with it?

House OS

And then, there is House OS, an operating system built with the Haskell compiler. It has a GUI that I found to be fairly responsive. I suppose the House OS could be useful, depending upon what a person might want to do. The House OS is at pdx.edu, and that site hosts a floppy image that makes House easy to try. Of course I'm the troglodyte with dozens of floppies laying around :-)

Too primitive for most

Edit: Some of the operating systems I've listed are more primitive than what the typical user might want to load and run, just for grins. But, I've listed some operating systems that are maybe in the "less primitive of the primitive" category.

Haiku. Minix3, FreeBSD

Of the OS candidates in my original list, I mostly make use of FreeBSD, Haiku, and Minix3. Lately I've been using Haiku more than FreeBSD, for general web browsing in particular. This is in spite of the fact that they say it's "alpha stage" software. Always, with open source, it's "caveat emptor"! Haiku does crash on my hardware, but not very often in my experience. They don't say much about security on their site. But - for just hangin'round the net, in my personal opinion - looks good, tastes great! I've used the latest version of Minix (3) for more browsing than I ever thought I would.

L4

I'm surprised nobody has listed any of the L4 variants. The most popular variant is L4 Linux. Blasphemy! That could explain why it's not listed here on this thread! However; I could guess that the "L" in L4 stands for the original (main) author's name, Jochen Liedtke, and not for "Linux"! L4 itself is not Linux. The work on the series has been done at various places, including the Karlsruhe Institute, Uni South Wales, and the Technical Uni /Dresden. Mostly German stuff.

L4 is a microkernel / hypervisor, upon which (in the default implementation) a "normal" Linux OS runs along with a RTOS (real time operating system). There is a CD DEMO ISO available that is great for peeking at an instance of the Linux/Demo-RTOS combo running on the L4 micro kernel. Look up "L4-Linux" and "DEMO CD". There's a floppy available that runs only the L4 micro kernel and a simple demo RTOS on top of it. The floppy has a nice kernel debugger (as does the CD), so you can play with it.

In my readings, I've found that (apparently) the L4 micro kernel architecture was adapted by commercial interests, and used in embedded devices such as cell phones. One claim I've found is that over 1.5 billion devices (including many cell phones), run an "L4 variant" software collection, with the baseband processing handled by an RTOS (or whatever), and the userland handled by whatever they decide to use for that. The company is OK Labs, which has subsequently been purchased by General Dynamics, a defense contractor.

Singularity

Blaspheme! Yes, it's an interesting OS, even though it's from Microsoft. While I mention Linux, I may as well mention Singularity :-) It's code is Microsoft reseach licensed source. I read where it cost millions. It's distributed on Codeplex, where I see only 60k downloads. I imagine Microsoftees are wondering what they did wrong to be so ignored!

[censored]

Ok, done now!

(Until I find another nugget that just begs to heat my CD burner)

[raindog308]

Somewhat less obscure operating systems I didn't see mentioned...

DragonflyBSD

Bitrig (OpenBSD fork)

GNU hurd

Linux is Linux is Linux...what's different between different distros is pretty minimal because they all start with the Linux kernel + GNU. The major differences seems to be the package installers and the syntax to add/remove a package is not a big differentiator to me. If you want something different for Linux, try http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/

[LeFrettchen]

Originally Posted by raindog308

Somewhat less obscure operating systems I didn't see mentioned...

DragonflyBSD

Bitrig (OpenBSD fork)

These ones don't sound so obscure for me...

[Oko]

Originally Posted by LeFrettchen

These ones don't sound so obscure to me...

+1

[sacerdos_daemonis]

Even people who have never used BSD, but have done even minimal research into it know about Dragonfly. So it is definitely not obscure.

[JWJones]

I've been running 9front (plan9 fork) for a couple of weeks now, and I really like it.

[roddierod]

Does 9front have an email app and how usable is mothra, I'm guessing not ebay or youtube?

Is that UPS command line app part of 9front?

[JWJones]

I haven't really delved into email yet, fqa with links to man pages are here:

http://fqa.9front.org/fqa8.html#8.4.1

For web browsing, there's both mothra and abaco, but yeah, no javascript, so most websites such as that are a no-go.

The ups/fedex/usps cli app is part of 9front, yes.

[bomasthayes]

I, too, have been using 9front on and off for a while now. Mail works in acme, upas and nupas are available. It runs great on an x230, inluding wifi (wpa (8)).

[rons]

Probably should throw RiscOS onto the list of obscure operating systems (its die-hard aficionados would decry that it's obscure!) It takes a raspberry (or something akin like a beagle) to run it though...

A more well-known thing to come from some of the RiscOS folks is Netsurf. Now that's a nice piece of software work.

[PapaParrot]

On another forum, a member mentioned this, TempleOS,

Developer Terry A. Davis
Written in HolyC

talk about obscure, I had never heard of it
but apparently it really exists, I have not tried it myself, but the OP claims it works:

Right now, I've got it running my TempleOS LiveCD